Indigenous Peoples

[Binnacle]

"The future of Australia's relationship with its indigenous peoples could be significantly influenced by a meeting at Uluru this week. It will discuss changing the constitution, but may also include support for a treaty. Australia does not have one, unlike many nations, reports Trevor Marshallsea.

In 1832, the governor of Van Diemen's Land reflected ruefully on his colonial administration's chaotic - and bloody - relationship with the island's indigenous population."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-40024622

[YM-Mundrabilla]

BBC should mind its own business.
Pity that they cannot even spell Eyre's Rock.

[Pat Kennedy]

Originally Posted by Binnacle

"The future of Australia's relationship with its indigenous peoples could be significantly influenced by a meeting at Uluru this week. It will discuss changing the constitution, but may also include support for a treaty. Australia does not have one, unlike many nations, reports Trevor Marshallsea.

In 1832, the governor of Van Diemen's Land reflected ruefully on his colonial administration's chaotic - and bloody - relationship with the island's indigenous population."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-40024622

You are a brave man Binnacle bringing the subject of aborigines to the attention of our 'Down Under' members.
They do not welcome any discussion of this thorny subject and immediately go on the defensive.
Pat

[jmilcon]

Originally Posted by YM-Mundrabilla

BBC should mind its own business.
Pity that they cannot even spell Eyre's Rock.

YM did you mean Ayers Rock??? Confusing explorers with colonial governors methinks.

[YM-Mundrabilla]

Originally Posted by jmilcon

YM did you mean Ayers Rock??? Confusing explorers with colonial governors methinks.

Correct Jmilcon.
Humblest apologies to the BBC (who I still think should mind their own business).

[jmilcon]

YM none required. But, as Pat Kennedy says, it is a thorny subject, sadly, and after 50 years we don't seem to have moved forward.
Cheers
John
PS Keep those Melbourne maritime photos coming!

[Tom Alexander]

The situation in Oz is possibly a good thing. In North America (including Canada) there were some treaty's signed in the 1800's but they, in retrospect, are seemingly vague for interpretation. We in Western Canada have been engaged in various treaty negotitations for well over 20 years, and in many cases still with no resolution in sight. It may take a lot longer, but I think the intent is to try and get it right this time around.

[Samsette]

Originally Posted by Tom Alexander

The situation in Oz is possibly a good thing. In North America (including Canada) there were some treaty's signed in the 1800's but they, in retrospect, are seemingly vague for interpretation. We in Western Canada have been engaged in various treaty negotitations for well over 20 years, and in many cases still with no resolution in sight. It may take a lot longer, but I think the intent is to try and get it right this time around.

Exactement! The huge land claim settlement in the Nass Valley of British Columbia, known as the Nishga-a Treaty was formulated in 1998 and brought into effect two years later. Getting it right is far from easy and with so many claims to be dealt with, likely to take some time with a lot of negotiating to satisfy all sides of the problem.
I have confidence that Australia will get it right also, as we are attempting to do and without any input from the BBC, The Guardian or friend Pat. Never-the-less, all comment on the subject is welcome, considering the problems arose, in the first place, from British colonial policies.

[Pat Kennedy]

Originally Posted by Samsette

Exactement! The huge land claim settlement in the Nass Valley of British Columbia, known as the Nishga-a Treaty was formulated in 1998 and brought into effect two years later. Getting it right is far from easy and with so many claims to be dealt with, likely to take some time with a lot of negotiating to satisfy all sides of the problem.
I have confidence that Australia will get it right also, as we are attempting to do and without any input from the BBC, The Guardian or friend Pat. Never-the-less, all comment on the subject is welcome, considering the problems arose, in the first place, from British colonial policies.

Fear not. I will look into it as soon as I get time and let you know where you are going wrong.
Regards,
Friend Pat

[lakercapt]

The land claims by the first nations is becoming a joke which if I am to understand it means they were all over the place called Canada. Even the word of a person that dreamed that a bear was a scared symbol he though was protecting sacred burial grounds. When are we going to stop these so called claims. Maybe soon some so called band will claim my property as an ancient hunting ground.
They receive massive amounts of cash from the Government, pay no taxes and are forever complaining about some preceived wrong inflicted on ""My people"

[Tom Alexander]

Originally Posted by lakercapt

The land claims by the first nations is becoming a joke which if I am to understand it means they were all over the place called Canada. Even the word of a person that dreamed that a bear was a scared symbol he though was protecting sacred burial grounds. When are we going to stop these so called claims. Maybe soon some so called band will claim my property as an ancient hunting ground.
They receive massive amounts of cash from the Government, pay no taxes and are forever complaining about some preceived wrong inflicted on ""My people"

I don't know about you folk who live in what we Westerners regard as the Far East, but having reviewed the Douglas Treaty, and what ensued, a lot of Indian claims, I believe, are well founded. For quite some time they were opressed. Only recently with better education, they are building a far better future and have built many of their reserve lands into self supporting enterprises. There is still a lot of squalor and poverty on some revervations, but things are gradually improving. Our local band have just broken ground on a new medical centre on their reserve. It will not only serve band members, but others who live in the area.

Realistically I don't think any chief expects to reposses any of their original lands, even ones with whiteman's houses on -- they would like reasonable compensation -- look at it as back rent if you will.

The major problem is that there are a few chiefs who act like Robert Mugabes and skim most of the band cash allotments, leaving the majority of their band in poverty. I think that gradually even the bad apples will get weeded out.

[lakercapt]

What you say Tom is partly true for your part of the country. The bands are supposed to give audited accounts of the money they receive from Goverment but with a few exceptions this has not been done. Findings show the chief has spent massive amounts on himself and family while other members live in substandard housing etc. One locl band had a new water purification system costing many millions of dollars installed. One band member was trained to opperate this after the manufacturers left. Not long afterwards they were called back as the person did not follow proceedures and many of the band had to be transported to hospitals very sick. It appears that all we seem to do is have our prime minister say sorry for some preceived wrong white man has inflicted on the first nations. Some cases it was the way at that time and we cannot change history although this is what is expected for some.

[Tom Alexander]

Originally Posted by lakercapt

What you say Tom is partly true for your part of the country. The bands are supposed to give audited accounts of the money they receive from Goverment but with a few exceptions this has not been done. Findings show the chief has spent massive amounts on himself and family while other members live in substandard housing etc. One locl band had a new water purification system costing many millions of dollars installed. One band member was trained to opperate this after the manufacturers left. Not long afterwards they were called back as the person did not follow proceedures and many of the band had to be transported to hospitals very sick. It appears that all we seem to do is have our prime minister say sorry for some preceived wrong white man has inflicted on the first nations. Some cases it was the way at that time and we cannot change history although this is what is expected for some.

Maybe we should give the bad ones the ultimatum -- shape up, or ship out! Forget the apologies in their case. But thinking about it, why, in the case of the water system, was only one band member trained? Surely some back up would be essential? Kind of like having a Boeing 747 operating regularly with just the pilot. The buck should always stop at the top whether it's the Government, or Walmart. Problems can almost always be traced to upper management.

[john hardy]

with the gubbermint we have in Australia (and the opposition) they could not run a chook raffle, never mind something as delicate as changing the constitution or a treaty. but that's not important at the moment, same sex marriage is the biggie. we obviously have nothing better to discuss down under. over these clowns.

[Samsette]

Originally Posted by Pat Kennedy

Fear not. I will look into it as soon as I get time and let you know where you are going wrong.
Regards,
Friend Pat

That has lifted a great burden from my colonial shoulders, Pat. I had a feeling that you would be there when needed.